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North West Discussion http://ukastle.co.uk/discussion/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=61 |
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Author: | meppso [ Tue Jun 27, 2017 12:04 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: North West Discussion |
Hi All, The LED march is still going strong in Cumbria with lots of old lanterns being taken down and new LEDs going up in their place. Here is a strange setup in Whitehaven where the old lanterns have been removed and new LED lanterns fitted on Concrete columns. https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.55954 ... 312!8i6656 Shame to see such relics as this making way for the LED massacre. I believe this to be an Eleco SR304 https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.54374 ... 312!8i6656 I had some sad news last week that this Gem has been scrapped. https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.63884 ... 312!8i6656 and another one further down the same street! https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.63807 ... 312!8i6656 This top entry Eleco has also gone https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.82494 ... 312!8i6656 A lovely old Beta 4 in Anthorn has also gone https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.91566 ... 312!8i6656 But the biggest loss of them all was this internally geared Eleco GR501 https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@54.86355 ... 312!8i6656 Regards, Andrew. |
Author: | Beta 5 [ Wed Jun 28, 2017 8:41 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: North West Discussion |
What is this obsession with LED? Its not just street lighting but all lighting being replaced, with claims of "25 years life" or 50,000hrs life, despite the fact some have failed in just 2 years - only around halfway through a SOX lamps life, and probably less than halfway through a well made SON lamps life. |
Author: | Paianni [ Thu Jun 29, 2017 5:07 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: North West Discussion |
Beta 5 wrote: The only factor that bugs me is that only white LEDs are economical to use, all the other colours remove the efficiency advantages, and none of them are fully monochromatic either. I'm hoping that laser diodes can offer an alternative for monochromatic colours at a similar efficiency, in similar luminaires. |
Author: | GreatNorburyStDepot [ Fri Jun 30, 2017 3:02 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: North West Discussion |
Paianni wrote: Beta 5 wrote: I apologise if the topic has slid away from North West Discussion, therefore I'll keep it brief. Although LEDs have proved to be useful lightsources (at least in the short term anyway), the assumption that white LEDs are more economical over other colours, is probably based more on what the general public has been programmed to perceive as best, compared to "those dim, orange streetlights". When low pressure sodium was introduced from the 30s, the key attraction was the excellent efficacy over gas and GLS lamps. The fact that colour rendition was not seen as important, must have carried huge sway when you consider how much of the UK was ultimately lit by it, especially from the 1960s onwards. In this age of constant surveillance due to cctv as well as social media uploads, monochromatic lighting at night is now no longer seen as desirable / fashionable. With the increased incidence of civil disturbance, it comes as no surprise that LED's white light is seen by many as the only tool for fighting those crimes of the darkness. The problem though, is that whilst LED has brought numerous benefits to our towns and cities, such as lower running costs etc, there is one aspect which has not materialised - the equality of LED light. The equality of LED light? It could be an alien concept, so here is my theory. LED streetlights have been heavily promoted as offering "more for less for longer" ie more lumens for less Watts for a long time. Ok, fair enough and I will concede that there have been some awful installations of SOX and SON, which have been remarkably improved with LED, so in that respect I have no problems. My observation though is where the proud, civic centres are lit with copious quantities of LEDs, providing almost television studio quality lighting (and probably producing more CO2 than the old scheme), whilst those roads and streets on the outskirts have to fumble along through the night with more measly pickings (assuming they stay on that long). The downward adjustment in BS5489 to make white light more viable, means that whilst it may look better than SOX or SON, the amount of it is probably less and this would be more notable in residential areas. There have been plenty of reports in the papers about hostility to LED, regardless of their eco prowess. Additionally, LED lanterns will only provide a cut off distribution. Whilst good for energy bills, directing the publicly funded light to just where it is needed means the surrounding streetscene is left in the dark. Add a good line of trees or poor spacings into the equation and the result is very gloomy indeed. Surely, the advantages of good LED (including its design and installation) should be spread a little wider, beyond those areas that bring in the money! |
Author: | meppso [ Sat Jul 01, 2017 2:50 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: North West Discussion |
Hi All, I am out and about in Penrith today and came across an Atlas Beta 5 with three part bowl. Unfortunately it has lost its back section. I can imagine once the lamp fails it will be replaced with an LED. Regards, Andrew. |
Author: | meppso [ Sun Jul 02, 2017 7:42 am ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: North West Discussion | ||
Hi All, Here is a photo of the beta 5 with three(2) piece bowl.
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Author: | GreatNorburyStDepot [ Sun Jul 02, 2017 11:23 pm ] | ||||
Post subject: | Re: North West Discussion | ||||
Stockport in Cheshire has been a stronghold for SOX for many years, however in recent times, the 90 and 135W lamps have been all but eliminated from the borough's main roads in favour of Cosmops and a centralised computer management network. Side streets surprisingly have for the most part still retained their concrete mounted SOX, although there was a fair investment in the 80s to phase out timeclocks in favour of PECs, with column sleeving or replacement undertaken in many areas. Philips MI50s and Beta 5s were popular choices and most still remain in service. In the 90s, new / replacement installations used 6m stainless steel columns and this continues to this day. Until fairly recently, Philips MI36s were used on these installations, however Holophane's QSS lantern has been now slowly appearing in service both on new and as casual replacements. Despite the introduction of alternatives, SOX on side roads is still fairly widespread, especially around Bredbury and Romiley. I do suspect that Stockport will be forced into phasing SOX out in the future once lamp stocks dry up, however I am wondering whether something other than QSS is being considered instead? What I have noticed is that several of the CU and Stanton & Staveley columns, have recently been sleeved up to 6m rather than replaced outright. The interesting thing is that the existing SOX lanterns have been refitted onto the modified column. This might be down to stock supply issues or perhaps that another lantern choice is being earmarked in the near future ie LED. Either way, it is good that SOX will remain in operation (for the short term anyway).
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Author: | meppso [ Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:06 pm ] | ||
Post subject: | Re: North West Discussion | ||
Hi All, I hope everyone is well. This weekend I have been in Manchester for a family get together. The hotel I was stopping in at the top of Dean's Gate was opposite a bridge, under the bridge I was amazed to see SOX lighting. In an area full of led and metal halide it's nice to see SOX lighting. The lanterns were GEC and the columns were concrete. It looks like the lanterns are controlled with P42 sensors, they must be a low Lux setting being under there otherwise they would be on all the time. Regards, Andrew.
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Author: | GreatNorburyStDepot [ Tue Jul 18, 2017 10:24 pm ] | ||||
Post subject: | Re: North West Discussion | ||||
Re: SOX lanterns under the bridge near Deansgate, Manchester. Hi Andrew. When I saw your picture, I had to have a good think as to where about this was, however as Deansgate pretty much has a railway viaduct at both ends, it was quite straightforward to locate. This is actually within the city of Salford. They still seem to have plenty of concrete around, although as you have indicated what SOX remains is now under threat, especially from LED. I managed to find this area on GSV, however the area was still undergoing redevlopment (or gentrification). Despite this, the SOX lanterns are in service. Its good to know there are still a few pockets of SOX still around. I have included a couple of images which show the same bridge, as well as some other areas of Salford City Centre, which have also seen some changes.
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Author: | meppso [ Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:28 pm ] | |||
Post subject: | Re: North West Discussion | |||
Hi all, I have found a great blog on Flickr by a chap called Mark Bowerbank. He has uploaded lots of photographs of buses and trains over the years in various towns and inevitably these come with photographs of StreetLights. I spotted in one of his photos a great shot of the old Gamma 4s we used to have in Carlisle. We had three SON lanterns in the town center and five SOX lanterns in a Carpark. His link is https://www.flickr.com/photos/51738247@ ... 9184267919 Regards, Andrew.
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